Society of Robots - Robot Forum

Electronics => Electronics => Topic started by: Joesavage1 on February 15, 2009, 08:32:30 AM

Title: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 15, 2009, 08:32:30 AM
Hi, i have just printed off a perf (its called something like that i think) diagram of the PC board for $50 robot. I have bought everything on the list of instructions but on the diagram it says 9v battery here, why would i solder a component in a PC board that may need to be later replaced??

Please Reply Soon, as i really want to get started.


Thanks

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: cosminprund on February 15, 2009, 08:45:00 AM
You don't solder the actual battery, you solder the wires that go to the battery clip / battery holder.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 15, 2009, 08:48:08 AM
on the parts list there is not a 9V battery holder though.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Razor Concepts on February 15, 2009, 10:19:55 AM
You can mentally add it to the list  ;)

Also you could just skip the 9v battery. It's a hassle to use two batteries so for my board I just used the 4 AAs.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 15, 2009, 10:36:45 AM
how do i just use the 4x AA 's ?? What will i have to modify? i have a perf board diagram (or something) will this change? I REALLY want to get started on the $50 robot so please reply soon.

Thanks

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Razor Concepts on February 15, 2009, 11:05:33 AM
Just connect the red wires from the 4 AAs to where the 9v should have gone.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 15, 2009, 12:34:36 PM
but then what happens to where the 4 x AA batter pack origionaly was?
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Razor Concepts on February 15, 2009, 12:40:09 PM
That stays connected - just add another wire from positive of the battery to where the positive of the 9v should have been.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 15, 2009, 01:24:09 PM
i only have 1 4x AA pack, i thought you ment only using one, so i guess ill just use the 9V, i suppose you just wrap the wire around the terminals.


Thanks

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Razor Concepts on February 15, 2009, 01:45:37 PM
No, this is only using one. Connect the 4AA as it is shown in the diagram, but add another wire from positive of the 4AA to the positive of where the 9v should have been.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: cosminprund on February 15, 2009, 01:47:10 PM
Can't you get some clips for that 9V battery? Wrapping wires around the terminals is not a very durable solution, not even for a prototype. You should at least try soldering the wires to the battery, but that requires good luck, good technique or powerful equipment (I bought an 100W soldering thingy from the hardware store, the kind used by plumbers! Dirt cheap, but grate for soldering to batteries. Still requires some technique)
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Trumpkin on February 15, 2009, 03:05:19 PM
Or you could just connect the 4 AA battery pack like an NiMH pack.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on February 16, 2009, 02:49:17 PM
battery pack? what happens when you run outta juice? man, i highly suggest you get a battery holder of some sort.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Trumpkin on February 16, 2009, 04:52:52 PM
Quote
what happens when you run outta juice?
You recharge the batteries.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 21, 2009, 12:59:49 AM
Well im gonna wrap the wires round terminals. But now i have a few more questions.
1) I understand that GND stands for ground, but how exactly do i ground a wire? what do i do with it?

2)In The Perf Diagram it shows were everything goes on the PC board; but do i solder everything to the board as it is? Because the n wouldnt the all connect to each other beacause the bottom of the board is made of copper?

(sorry i wont be on SoR in a while a couple of things have poped up; but ill try to fit it in wherever i can)

Thanks

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Jdog on February 21, 2009, 01:18:46 AM
how do i just use the 4x AA 's ?? What will i have to modify? i have a perf board diagram (or something) will this change? I REALLY want to get started on the $50 robot so please reply soon.

Thanks

Joe
Follow the instructions for making it with a rechargeable battery pack and where you would normally plug in the battery, solder the + and - wires of the battery to their respective pins.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on February 21, 2009, 03:03:29 AM
wait, did you etch the board? or are you using a predrilled board that you bought? and to ground a wire you have to go outside and shove it into the dirt....im joking (thats what i used to think) pretty much everything that is called ground you have to connect together as with the $50 board. and one thing im confused about is negative the same as ground? and what you guys were discussing before doesnt the $50 robot use one 9v? or are you using the modified circuit?
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: MrWizard on February 21, 2009, 03:36:49 AM
Hello just building my first robot now ...

Is there a problem in the 50 D project if I use 5v-5Amp Linear Regulator ?
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on February 21, 2009, 03:51:40 AM
i dont think so but wait for someone who knows to confirm, well do circuits only draw the current they need? if so yes. if no it will burn it out.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: madchimp on February 21, 2009, 04:14:23 AM
The amps on the regulator simply tells you how many amps the regulator can handle before the magic smoke escapes. As long as the circuit calls for 5v and the amps the regulator can supply is over the amps required by the circuit you should be safe. There might be other reasons to not have a regulator that is way over kill like efficiency but for prototyping efficiency isn't as important as does it work.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on February 21, 2009, 04:31:17 AM
so the circuit will only draw what is needed? so for example if the regulator is 7805 (5v 1amp) it can only take in one amp and give out one amp?
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 21, 2009, 04:55:44 AM
Ok i sorta get the ground thing. but what about my second question?


Thanks

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on February 21, 2009, 05:01:38 AM
is the board your using a board like in the tutorial (the one with individual solder pads for each hole)? or has it got strips of copper? or is it one big sheet of copper with no holes?
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Razor Concepts on February 21, 2009, 09:33:56 AM

2)In The Perf Diagram it shows were everything goes on the PC board; but do i solder everything to the board as it is? Because the n wouldnt the all connect to each other beacause the bottom of the board is made of copper?


The botton of the board has copper circles around each hole. If the entire bottom of your board is made of copper than you've bought the wrong kind of board. On the diagram you just put in the components and solder them to the copper cicle. If the diagram shows that two things should be connected, use wire to connect copper circles to each other.


Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on February 21, 2009, 06:53:58 PM
yes lol i was thinking of a copper 'clad' board because he said he printed off the diagram. if you have the board with the individual pads for each hole nothing will connect unless you bridge it with solder( or a wire...)
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 22, 2009, 02:54:18 AM
i just bought the one of the UK list of parts; it probably has circles, its just from expriance in tech we used PC boards with all copper.
OK so it has holes, were do i solder the stuff onto, the holes or what? also if all the GND have to be together do i have the lead wired of the terminal to be grounded to one big ground wire bunch and then solder the wires together?

2) Also which ones negative and which ones posotive (red/black) because i found myself a 9v battery holder! (out of some old tech project)!


Thanks

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on February 22, 2009, 03:43:11 AM
ok, the component should be on the side with NO copper the legs should be sticking through the holes so they are on the side WITH copper then you solder the legs onto the side with copper making sure not to make two pads connect unless you need to like for the power buses. and your second question, im pretty sure all ground go together but the wiring diagram will say. im working on the $50 board right now too  :D
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 22, 2009, 07:40:04 AM
ok, the component should be on the side with NO copper the legs should be sticking through the holes so they are on the side WITH copper then you solder the legs onto the side with copper making sure not to make two pads connect unless you need to like for the power buses. and your second question, im pretty sure all ground go together but the wiring diagram will say. im working on the $50 board right now too  :D

How did you know the power busses needed to be soldered to the pads and not the the components next to them (i assume this is what you are saying although i dont fully understand what you are saying)


Thanks In Advance

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Razor Concepts on February 22, 2009, 10:50:03 AM
Whatever components you put in, always solder them into their own little pads. This is to make sure they are mounted securely on the board. Then, when you need to connect things together (like all the Grounds together), you can use solder or wires to connect the pads together.

Just look at the pictures Admin took for the $50 robot, should clear things up.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 22, 2009, 12:12:51 PM
so everything is soldered to its own little pad and is only connected by wires. So in this picture:

(http://www.societyofrobots.com/images/sbs_connect0.JPG)
nothing is acctuly connected, there just all soldered onto the board?


Thanks

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 22, 2009, 12:14:58 PM
Quote
READ THIS POST before continuing!!! I designed the programmer header for an older programmer version, so chances are you will need to convert it to the new 6 pin header. It is easier to wire, it just requires a bit more of thought. Just check the number of pins on your programmer cable to know if you need 6 pins or 10 pins.

How do i have to change things to work with the newer thing (if anything needs to be changed)?
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Razor Concepts on February 22, 2009, 01:17:56 PM
so everything is soldered to its own little pad and is only connected by wires. So in this picture:

(http://www.societyofrobots.com/images/sbs_connect0.JPG)
nothing is acctuly connected, there just all soldered onto the board?


Thanks

Joe

Correct. Later on, Admin goes through and bridges the pads that need to be connected.

As for the programming headers, it depends on which programmer you will use - so what programmer are you using?
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: MrWizard on February 22, 2009, 03:15:50 PM
Yes first solder everything to the small islands, so every component is stuck to board. Then read the howto carefully, because the text tells you what to do.
Later on in the How to everything becomes clear, do follow the how to carefully.....

Same as me last night....new with it too, but just follow it and it will work..

Ooops...kinda double post
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on February 22, 2009, 11:17:57 PM
make sure you show us pictures of your board later :)
for the programmer headers look at the programmer you are using and see how many holes there are. if it is different then we'll talk. also does anyone know where a tutorial to make your programmer cable is?
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 23, 2009, 09:22:10 AM
i have the MKII or something with the ATMEG8 or something.

Also im confused how to connect the -/+ of the servo to something as its in a weird plactic block with three metal pads.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 23, 2009, 12:52:44 PM
ive found out from the cable its a 6 pin, what do i have to change?
PLEASE REPLY SOON, IVE ALREADY STARTED AND NOW IM HOOKED WITH THE SOLDERING!


Thanks

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: RiffRaff on February 23, 2009, 01:24:10 PM
At this point, I think you are correct, that noting is connected- all soldering is only to fastend the components to the board.  Some of those things WILL be connected later though.  Of the three 6-pin headers, the one on the right- all the pins will be connected together; this is the gound.  For the 6-pin header in the center- all pins are connected also; this is your postive or power side.  Now for the 6-pin header on the left, each pin will be connected to the dip socket pins even with them to make circuits with the controller chip which will be plugged into the dip socket.  So you will have to bridge the space between the left pins and the socket with either solder or wire- soldered wires.  I used wires because my soldering iron is too blunt and my soldering too sloppy so I got too much solder on the board and risked shorting between the individual bridges.

Does that make it clear, or just confuse you?  I'm pretty new at this too.

Riff
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: superchiku on February 23, 2009, 01:29:00 PM
that looks exactly like the ADMIN's soldering...image...good job...
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: RiffRaff on February 23, 2009, 01:37:19 PM
ive found out from the cable its a 6 pin, what do i have to change?
PLEASE REPLY SOON, IVE ALREADY STARTED AND NOW IM HOOKED WITH THE SOLDERING!


Thanks

Joe

The schematic attached to this post should help you figure out your programmer connections:
http://www.societyofrobots.com/robotforum/index.php?topic=3292.0 (http://www.societyofrobots.com/robotforum/index.php?topic=3292.0)

Riff
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 23, 2009, 02:07:37 PM
OH.. ok thanks, i realise now, i just add a couple of pins.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on February 23, 2009, 02:48:14 PM
that looks exactly like the ADMIN's soldering...image...good job...
...that is admins soldering job.... look in the tut
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 24, 2009, 09:40:06 AM
Ok, i have now got a problem, i just figured out how to do all of it, and when i was doing the last three pins the solder all of a sudden sticks to the iron!!!! On the web someone said this is because the tip is dirty, but ive tried everything to clean it!, does anyone have any suggestions?

Please Help

Thanks In Advance

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 24, 2009, 09:49:43 AM
Also, which resistors do i use the 0.25W or the 0.4W?
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 24, 2009, 10:20:19 AM
Also i think i may have put the DIP socket thing the wrong way round, does this matter? i figure it just matters which way you acctuly put the microcontroller in it.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: MrWizard on February 24, 2009, 11:48:48 AM
The DIP around, in function it will work.  But it can confuse someone else if he/sha has to look at your soldering-project. The little mark in the middle points to the side of  the mark on the controller and pin 1.

For the better solder it the wright way so nobody gets confused (keeping to standards is a virtue).
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on February 24, 2009, 01:31:50 PM
use the modify button please, and you should be fine with 1/4 watt resistors. it doesnt matter which way the socket is unless its a special shape (which its not). and to clean your soldering iron get a soldering stand with a sponge tray, moisen the sponge and heat the iron up. when the iron is hot wipe it on the sponge. hope this helped  :)
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 24, 2009, 01:40:35 PM
Ok, thanks for the reply, i will next time use the modify button, sorry about that. Thanks For the info on teh socket and resistors that really helped, but the soldering iron still does not work aafter cleaning with a wet spounge.


Thanks

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on February 24, 2009, 01:43:48 PM
hmm, how do you solder? do you apply solder onto the iron and bomb the component? or do you heat the lead then add solder? also for anyone who knows whats the value for the resistor for the led (near the power buses)? is it 1.62k? or 340ohm?
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: MrWizard on February 24, 2009, 03:04:46 PM
He dips the whole board with components in a heated solder pan .....I suppose  ;D ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: MrWizard on February 24, 2009, 03:11:50 PM
hmm, how do you solder? do you apply solder onto the iron and bomb the component? or do you heat the lead then add solder? also for anyone who knows whats the value for the resistor for the led (near the power buses)? is it 1.62k? or 340ohm?

The resistor before the LED must be 340 ohm , it just prevents the LED from being a one second shiny star.
The 1.6 Kohm resistors are used for the Photoresistors (eyes) in the project.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on February 25, 2009, 12:15:50 AM
ahh yes, i didnt think about the photo's. thanks bud  :D im almost finished the board, everything but the dip socket is in!
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: cosminprund on February 25, 2009, 02:09:18 AM
hmm, how do you solder? do you apply solder onto the iron and bomb the component? or do you heat the lead then add solder? also for anyone who knows whats the value for the resistor for the led (near the power buses)? is it 1.62k? or 340ohm?

You NEVER put solder on the soldering iron and then bomb components :) Spend 10 minutes and learn some good soldering technique, you'd be amassed by the results. I know I was :D The idea's to apply heat to the spot where the two components meet and then introduce the solder, it will flow and fill the gaps between the components. Something based on surface tension and capillarity. There were a few videos on soldering posted on the Videos or on the Misc areas lately, look them up. Or search for "soldering" on YouTube, you'll find them.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on February 25, 2009, 02:14:35 AM
yes i know, that is how i solder know. i used to 'bomb' the components if space wasn't crucial but now with microcontrollers i have learnt to be precise.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 25, 2009, 09:42:58 AM
lol, i dont bomb the components, i solder properly, it turns out that the spounge thing DID work, BUT after i tried to solder without cleaning at first one of the pads has gone all black and will not be soldered just on that pad.

Please Help.
Thanks

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on February 25, 2009, 02:35:01 PM
hehe, when you first heat the iron up wipe it on the sponge and then apply a small amount of solder onto the end (tinning). i get that black stuff too sometimes, never knew what it was.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on February 26, 2009, 12:54:08 AM
dont worry, i got it fixed now, i used wire wool, or steel wool or something to just wipe the muck of the end!

Thanks

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on March 01, 2009, 01:00:52 AM
OK, i got two more questions;

1) im confused how i wouold attach the photoresistors onto the pins.

2)After i finished im going to add the IR rangefinder expansion, i have a spare speaker that i might make do something interisting, how do i test it the speaker works (it should do because the TV's sound worked before i took it apart i just want to double check) And how would i make the speaker say anything, or would i need a bigger thing instead of the Atmeg8? If i need a bigger than Atmeg8 then i wont bother (for now) but the anwsers will still be used eventuly (maybe with another robot).



Thanks


Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on March 01, 2009, 01:11:55 AM
if you've made the sensors just plug em in (make sure ground wire is on the farthest pin away from the mcu)! thats if you crimped the end, if you didnt you'll need to crimp them http://www.societyofrobots.com/electronics_wire_connector.shtml make sure power is in the middle! good luck
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on March 01, 2009, 01:25:02 AM
It dosnt have that black thing on though, i bought the photoresistors, they have one posotive and one negative terminal (well 2 terminals each at least).
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on March 01, 2009, 01:29:55 AM
oh my god... http://www.societyofrobots.com/schematics_photoresistor.shtml
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on March 01, 2009, 01:48:53 AM
Yer, it looks like the ones at the top. BTW, i dont want to have to buy a molex or wtv.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on March 01, 2009, 02:17:03 AM
well i guess you could just tape the wires on... or if you dont mind it being permanent you could desolder the pin and solder the wire there. but i really do recommend getting the crimps and a crimper. mine was $6us and works like a dream :) i got mine from futurlec for really cheap
pin 10 pack part no: HDPINF
3 pin housing part no: HDCONNS3
if you think you will continue with robotics or electronics in general i recomend you get like 10 of each so you get a discount. they're just plain handy to have around! ;)
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on March 02, 2009, 10:02:56 AM
ill solder them for now, but how do i go about soldering them on?

Also i will buy with my next project/purchase i make with an online electronics store, but its getting tiring keep having to redo p&p for now.


Thanks In Advance

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Razor Concepts on March 02, 2009, 10:06:26 AM
Just get some free samples of female breakaway headers. I got a bunch and use them for unimportant things, and I use the molex connectors and crimpers for more important stuff.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on March 02, 2009, 10:07:08 AM
o have the breakaway headers, but what bits do i solder where??
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Razor Concepts on March 02, 2009, 10:11:11 AM
Female breakaway headers is what I'm talking about. Do not solder to your male breakaway headers because you won't be able to plug anything in them later on.

(http://www.conser.com.tw/manager/upload/200605120941112.jpg)
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on March 02, 2009, 11:45:38 AM
oh, well as i said i dont wanna but anything more, so female headers is even more out of the question as i may aswell do it the other way if i way going to buy anything..
I need a solution were i dont have to buy anything extra but it dont look to ghetto either.




Thanks In Advance

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Razor Concepts on March 02, 2009, 12:41:55 PM
No no, read more carefully  ;D

Just get some free samples of female breakaway headers. I got a bunch and use them for unimportant things, and I use the molex connectors and crimpers for more important stuff.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on March 02, 2009, 12:57:01 PM
theres always 'sampling' to be had joe!
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: chelmi on March 02, 2009, 12:59:43 PM
oh, well as i said i dont wanna but anything more, so female headers is even more out of the question as i may aswell do it the other way if i way going to buy anything..
I need a solution were i dont have to buy anything extra but it dont look to ghetto either.

Thanks In Advance

Joe

Just solder the cable to the board in this case...
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on March 02, 2009, 01:31:39 PM
yea that too. i guess if you ever get bored you could desolder the wires or attach them to a female molex :-\
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on March 03, 2009, 09:28:38 AM
What cables? i see two metal terminals on the bottom thats all. (btw if your reffering to the link, then is there another way that i dont have to mess around with extra wires and things?)


Thanks


Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: chelmi on March 03, 2009, 12:58:01 PM
What cables? i see two metal terminals on the bottom thats all.
The cable between the photoresistor and your board. If you attach the photoresistor directly to the board you wont be able to position it correctly on each side of the robot.

(btw if your reffering to the link, then is there another way that i dont have to mess around with extra wires and things?)

Well, I don't follow you here. You have to physically connect you sensor to you MCU! there is no magic, you need a cable!
Honestly, if you want to build a robot, you have to deal with cables!!! It's part of the fun!

Chelmi.

Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on March 03, 2009, 01:00:44 PM
ahh you stopped me posting chelmi!
anyway. ok so you've got your photosensor, your resistor and your 3 wires. solder one wire to each leg (red and signal) then below one of the wires solder the 1k resistor, on the end of this solder the gnd wire. i am not sure about this but i think thats the way it goes. someone confirm this?
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Razor Concepts on March 03, 2009, 04:12:59 PM
(http://www.societyofrobots.com/images/schematics_photoinc.jpg)

So Vout would go to the signal pin, Vin would go to positive 5v, and GND (the three line things) go to ground.

Or basically what smash said is correct.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: dellagd on March 03, 2009, 09:07:54 PM
you guys got it.
just a few words of advice.
If you have a desoldering tool, use it carefully on the board, the whole copper soldering ring on it may get sucked off(bad experiences).
then it is way harder to solder your components on ;)
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on March 03, 2009, 11:27:52 PM
you guys got it.
just a few words of advice.
If you have a desoldering tool, use it carefully on the board, the whole copper soldering ring on it may get sucked off(bad experiences).
then it is way harder to solder your components on ;)
same thing happened on my first $50 board. the four solder rings in between power and 5v reg got melted off. so ill try and jumper it sometime :-\
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on March 04, 2009, 10:04:02 AM
Ok, the Vin and Vout thing confused me, also can u repeat the wire with resistor thing explanation it also confused me (i know im easilly confused!).


Also..

It's part of the fun!

Lol, that made me laugh for a while; I will use the wire way when i fully understand.




Thanks



Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on March 04, 2009, 12:29:21 PM
"vin" is voltage in
"vout" is voltage out
"gnd" is ground
so vin is +, vout is signal in this case?, gnd is negative power.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on March 05, 2009, 08:29:24 AM
"vin" is voltage in
"vout" is voltage out
"gnd" is ground
so vin is +, vout is signal in this case?, gnd is negative power.

Can you just explain it in simple terms for now? without the Vin And Vout.



Thanks


Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Razor Concepts on March 05, 2009, 11:33:43 AM
GND connects to the outer row of headers (ground)
VIN connects to the middle row of headers (+5 power)
Vout connects to the inner row of headers (connected to MCU pins)
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on March 05, 2009, 12:37:10 PM
No Offence, but I asked for insturctions without the whole Vin and Vout Thing, just while im making, ill figure out how that bit works after



Thanks

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on March 05, 2009, 01:21:20 PM
okay then, arrange them like this:

GROUND
+5V
SIGNAL
okay so it doesnt matter to much as long as the +5v is in the middle because you can always flip the header around cant ye?
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: chelmi on March 05, 2009, 01:36:20 PM
No Offence, but I asked for insturctions without the whole Vin and Vout Thing, just while im making, ill figure out how that bit works after

Thanks

Joe

Really, there is no other way to explain it other than looking at the schematic and identifying the wires (If Vin and Vout confuse you, name them 1, 2, 3 or alice, bob, carol whatever).
This is a really simple circuit, resistors don't have polarity. Put you component on the table and try to mimic the schematic given by Razor. If it helps, draw it on a piece of paper and lay the component on the schematic. Then solder the junction between the resistor and the photresistor. Now connect each point of the circuit to the corresponding pin with a piece of wire, as explained by Razor.

Chelmi

PS: my advice: don't rush. If you don't understand how this circuit works, take some time to learn basic electronic. It will really save you time later. If you build your bot without understanding how it is supposed to work, you will likely screw something up. And since you will have no idea of how it is supposed to work, you won't be able to debug it. This is going to be very frustrating.

This one seems good: http://www.ikalogic.com/beg_1_res_v_c.php (http://www.ikalogic.com/beg_1_res_v_c.php)
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: dellagd on March 05, 2009, 02:50:59 PM
I have another question about the circuit.
how come there are 3 dots colored pink on the microcontroller?
which go to which?
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: householdutensils on March 05, 2009, 03:31:25 PM
I have another question about the circuit.
how come there are 3 dots colored pink on the microcontroller?
which go to which?


All those contacts should be connected to your 5v power bus.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on March 06, 2009, 01:34:24 AM
okay then, arrange them like this:

GROUND
+5V
SIGNAL
okay so it doesnt matter to much as long as the +5v is in the middle because you can always flip the header around cant ye?

How do i arrange them like that???? I see 2 terminals, which one is +5v whats GND and whats SIGNAL.?




Sorry For Noobishness


Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: chelmi on March 06, 2009, 09:59:37 AM
okay then, arrange them like this:

GROUND
+5V
SIGNAL
okay so it doesnt matter to much as long as the +5v is in the middle because you can always flip the header around cant ye?

How do i arrange them like that???? I see 2 terminals, which one is +5v whats GND and whats SIGNAL.?

Sorry For Noobishness

Joe

http://www.societyofrobots.com/robotforum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3292.0;attach=2439 (http://www.societyofrobots.com/robotforum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3292.0;attach=2439)

We are talking about sensor inputs.

blue is signal
black is ground
+5V is mauve
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on March 08, 2009, 06:39:21 AM
okay then, arrange them like this:

GROUND
+5V
SIGNAL
okay so it doesnt matter to much as long as the +5v is in the middle because you can always flip the header around cant ye?

How do i arrange them like that???? I see 2 terminals, which one is +5v whats GND and whats SIGNAL.?

Sorry For Noobishness

Joe

http://www.societyofrobots.com/robotforum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3292.0;attach=2439 (http://www.societyofrobots.com/robotforum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3292.0;attach=2439)

We are talking about sensor inputs.

blue is signal
black is ground
+5V is mauve

I know, but which wires go where???
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Razor Concepts on March 08, 2009, 10:46:31 AM
Wires are all labeled here
(http://www.societyofrobots.com/images/schematics_photoinc.jpg)
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: chelmi on March 08, 2009, 11:38:32 AM
okay then, arrange them like this:

GROUND
+5V
SIGNAL
okay so it doesnt matter to much as long as the +5v is in the middle because you can always flip the header around cant ye?

How do i arrange them like that???? I see 2 terminals, which one is +5v whats GND and whats SIGNAL.?

Sorry For Noobishness

Joe

http://www.societyofrobots.com/robotforum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3292.0;attach=2439 (http://www.societyofrobots.com/robotforum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3292.0;attach=2439)

We are talking about sensor inputs.

blue is signal
black is ground
+5V is mauve

I know, but which wires go where???

Can you be more specific? go where on the board or on the sensors?
Did you open the document I linked? This cannot be more explicit... You have to make an effort, I wont solder the parts for you...

Chelmi.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on March 09, 2009, 03:13:12 AM
here this clear it up a bit? left middle and right are how to arrange them in the molex. the resistor is the 1.6k or something one.
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: paulstreats on March 09, 2009, 10:40:39 AM
that drawings wrong smash. Where you have the Vin wants to be the Vout(where it connects to the adc pin).

Vin and GND should be connected to the other 2
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on March 09, 2009, 01:01:31 PM
I just wanna know were i connect the wires to the terminals, then where i connect them to the board.... Vin and Vout for now confuses me, at the end of the project ill re look over it.

Thanks

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: paulstreats on March 09, 2009, 01:24:43 PM
Heres a picture. The big black thing on the bottom is the connector. plug the wires into it in that order.

black     = GND
red wire = +5v
yellow    = Vout / signal

When you plug it into your board the yellow wire wants to go closest to the microcontroller (connects to the adc pin)

(http://www.uk-robotics.co.uk/misc/photocell1.jpg)
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on March 09, 2009, 01:29:29 PM
isnt that what mine says? please clear up how mine is wrong. mine has +5v in the middle? or was my writing wrong?
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: paulstreats on March 09, 2009, 01:33:26 PM
The Vout should be from between the resistor and photocell
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on March 09, 2009, 01:37:16 PM
ohhh, i thought it wouldnt matter because theyre non polarised. does the resistor somehow affect the reading?
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: paulstreats on March 09, 2009, 01:45:31 PM
Yes. If you didnt need the resistor It wouldnt be there.

The photocell doesnt adjust the voltage, it only adjusts how much current can pass through(changes resistance in proportion to the light), the same with the resistor. The adc ports need a change in voltage so by connecting the resistor in the correct way, it causes the voltage to change depending on how much light is on the photoresistor
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on March 09, 2009, 01:49:46 PM
i know that but does the resistor affect the reading on the signal line, so does it matter which side is signal, resistor or no resistor?
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: paulstreats on March 09, 2009, 01:54:49 PM
Yes, the vout/signal of a voltage divider needs to come from between 2 resistors (in this case the photocell is a resistor).
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: SmAsH on March 09, 2009, 01:56:42 PM
ok that clears things up a bit! thanks mate :D
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Joesavage1 on March 13, 2009, 09:21:43 AM
Ok, that clears it up for the moment (although im not even onto doing this bit yet, i was asking upfront), ill ask if I have any more questions.

Thanks Guys!

Joe
Title: Re: $50 help with electronics
Post by: Admin on March 25, 2009, 12:52:17 AM
Quote
nothing is acctuly connected, there just all soldered onto the board?
yeap