Thanks for responding so quickly. No luck though. I tried with Avast and network shut off, then again with disabled network and USB, and in safe mode as administrator I think it's just my machine. It's an old Averatec laptop that refuses to accept XP service pack 3 and I think that is because the drivers are out of date, but Averatec appears to be defunct. Maybe this is just the push I need to start saying bye bye to windows and finally start learning to use Ubuntu. Thanks again for your help though, hopefully I'll be able to pay it forward some day.