Author Topic: SOR community project?  (Read 22079 times)

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Offline chelmi

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #60 on: April 21, 2009, 03:57:45 PM »
MCUs are cheap. So wasted I/O isn't that big a deal. I looked and couldn't find a small 8 pin AVR with I2C. Smallest is 28 pins so package size is still rather large but not a big deal.

Attiny25/45/85 are PDIP8 and support I2C through there USI unit. The trick is this is not called I2C in the spec but TWI for copyright reasons.

Offline SmAsHTopic starter

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #61 on: April 21, 2009, 04:31:24 PM »
i think that the cube idea is a bit far ahead and that we should get the actual module going first.
and chelmi, i will take a look at those and see if i can find them anywhere as my usual supplier doesn't stock em.
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Offline Weird Fishes

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #62 on: April 21, 2009, 05:31:21 PM »
I'm going to make a colour sensor board. I'd add it to the list but I don't have access.

Offline SmAsHTopic starter

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #63 on: April 21, 2009, 05:33:42 PM »
thats just a list of suggested modules that we could do. you are allowed to do other things. what type of color sensor is it? cam? something else?
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Offline Weird Fishes

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #64 on: April 21, 2009, 05:35:33 PM »
At first I'm gonna have another attempt at the rgb led and photo-resistor approach. If that doesn't work well enough, I'm going to rethink and switch my methods. I think it will work though...

Offline dellagd

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #65 on: April 21, 2009, 05:41:42 PM »
i could get one from raI guess I could make a acceleration sensor
I would get these from radioshack, but has anyone made one yet that I can look at to see how I actually build a module
just one person say "this is how we will build the modules" so I can build one correctly
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Offline SmAsHTopic starter

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #66 on: April 21, 2009, 05:48:01 PM »
@werid fishes: yea, thats what i was thinking would be the easiest.
@dellagd: pretty much you would make it how you would normallly have it ready to be hooked up to an mcu then hook it up to the mcu on your board and use the mcu's i2c to hook it up to the bus. if you dont understand ill pm with with a better explanation.
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Offline dellagd

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #67 on: April 21, 2009, 05:50:27 PM »
@werid fishes: yea, thats what i was thinking would be the easiest.
@dellagd: pretty much you would make it how you would normallly have it ready to be hooked up to an mcu then hook it up to the mcu on your board and use the mcu's i2c to hook it up to the bus. if you dont understand ill pm with with a better explanation.


pls do so

also arn't we doing individual modules like this

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Offline Ro-Bot-X

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #68 on: April 21, 2009, 07:59:31 PM »
Right now I'm on the verge of relocating to another apartment, so hobby is postponed. I just look from time to time on the forum to calm down from stress and head ache.

If you check the previous thread of SoR comunity project, you'll see that I was working on a small motor module using tiny26 and SN754410. Also I had plans for L298 to replace the SN.

Now I have other parts bought and I'm preparing the playground to build 2 motor drivers to be installed inside servos for my MiniEric robot. I will be using tiny45 and FAN8082. They are both 8 pin ICs, small enough and easy to work with. I also will be using 2 Hamamatsu P5587 IR photoreflecting sensors (with integrated trigger Schmidt) for a quadrature encoder to be installed inside the servo instead of the potentiometer. It is not a standard module, but I think it will make a nice alternative. Also the code will be the same as for a dual motor module.

Now let's talk a bit about the functionality of the motor module. To be able to set a speed we need to measure the current speed to be able to adjust it to get to the set value. For this we need encoders. Encoders should be using external interrupts to increment/decrement a counter and if we read it at the same time interval we can calculate the speed. So we need to connect the motor driver and encoders to the MCU on the module.

When we will get to the code, we will find out that we might want different types of motor control. For instance, we might want to go with a set speed, or with a set distance, or with a mixture. We also will also want to be able to turn on the spot some degrees or curve nicely. Then we might want to read the traveled distance, the current speed and so on. All these commands have to be hard coded and documented for the module so anyone else can use it easily.

So, there is a lot of thought and work on a motor module. At the time I felt I needed to step back for a while so I learn more to make sure I get it right where I want it. Now I will go ahead and start working on the I2C continuous servos, at least have the hardware ready for programming. But I would like to see you succeed on building the L298 module, so I'll help as much as I can.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2009, 08:01:13 PM by Ro-Bot-X »
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Offline SmAsHTopic starter

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #69 on: April 21, 2009, 08:14:24 PM »
why thank you ro-bot-x! im glad to see some support from people starting to build up again! i did think about having encoders on there but never really gave it much thought and went on to finishing the pcb. but would encoders mean more wires going down to the motors? and one last question, is it possible to use the l298 to drive one motor@4A?
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Offline galannthegreat

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #70 on: April 21, 2009, 08:24:33 PM »
The L298 can handle that kind of current but beware and take into consideration the stall currents and loads currents.
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Offline galannthegreat

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #71 on: April 21, 2009, 08:56:30 PM »
Hmm... now that I think of it, this is a great method to follow when building robots, and I think I'll use something along these lines for my next 'bot in the pot. Also for beginners out there who think robots are complicated and all, a good way is to think about them is, like this project here, to look at them is in individual modules.
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Offline SmAsHTopic starter

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #72 on: April 21, 2009, 09:16:30 PM »
well we do want this to be user(noob) friendly, most people who ive tried to get into robotics dropped out when i told them how easy it was then they saw the code.... they think that all robots are these cool bipeds with cannons for arms :-\ sad really...
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Offline galannthegreat

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #73 on: April 21, 2009, 09:26:20 PM »
Yes that's too sad that when people see the code of something they get kind of "scared" and fend away from it, now in all honesty the coding part for me is still like this in a sense, but that's the learning process... and I think I'm stuck in a loop. (no pun intended) ;D
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Offline SmAsHTopic starter

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #74 on: April 21, 2009, 09:44:27 PM »
hah, yea when i started i was scared s*#tless of the $50 robot and attempted the $40 robot instead.
i think most people who have never been introduced to robotics would see a plastic box with wires coming out of it more easy than the same thing with no box, ie just a pcb with components soldered on.
@dellagd, no we aren't really doing that sort of thing where they link together like that. we are doing something where its just a bunch of pcbs that can be linked via i2c.
@all, ive put together an updated list of modules based on dunks list as he is a busy man and probably has netter things to be doing. if i have missed anything or you want something added please pm me about it.
 modules
 
EDIT: i have added in I2C to my motor driver... this is the order i have my pins in (SDA-SCL-GND-+5V) is this correct?
EDIT2: attached images to help :P
« Last Edit: April 22, 2009, 02:39:52 AM by SmAsH »
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Offline dunk

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #75 on: April 22, 2009, 03:00:16 AM »
hi guys,
did you see the example module?
http://www.societyofrobots.com/member_tutorials/node/69

it's only intended as a test platform but the firmware implements the communication protocol we talked about last time.

in retrospect, the communication protocol between modules might have put a lot of people off the project.
while it is important modules communicate with each other in a standard way it might be simpler limiting this to the i2c bus.
adding the UART to the protocol complicates it significantly.

i have a motorcontroller using the LMD18200 on my robot which implements the communication protocol but the board layout would need some work to make it match the module specifications.
scroll down to the "Motor Controller" section here: http://mrdunk.googlepages.com/electronics
let me know if you want the firmware for the motor controller. i think i still have it somewhere.

i really don't have time to work on this just now as i'm getting ready to set off on a year's rock climbing trip. (no robotics for me for a while...)
but good luck with the module project.
having a set of circuit boards designs that fit together and work together will cut out a lot of the development time in future projects.


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Offline SmAsHTopic starter

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #76 on: April 22, 2009, 03:09:53 AM »
darn, i cant believe i missed that in the member tuts. hah, i didn't even know they were going to use uart at all? that probably would've made me only do this in like a years time when i would've had much more experience and grasp over the concept of uart. but i think that I2C will do fine as its simple yet it gets the job done. and we can probably just implement a module for this later cant we?

i think we'll be able to keep this project up while your gone as long, as we can get the first modules up and tested and keep interest growing/staying.
i just have two questions...
1st: in eagle is there a measuring tool. ie draw a line and it tells you how long it is?
2nd: if we decide to put the holes in the boards (not in the C shape) how far in do you think would be good approx?
and good luck with the rock climbing! it really sounds like fun, i love rock climbing!

PS: don't fall, we still need you ;D
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Offline Ro-Bot-X

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #77 on: April 22, 2009, 04:59:17 AM »
About the holes, many people have an Axon or they are going to get one at some point. I think you can go ahead and use the Axon board as a template for the motor controller. That means board size, shape, holes placing and size. I hope Roboduino has at least 2 holes at the same distance as the Axon...
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Offline SmAsHTopic starter

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #78 on: April 22, 2009, 05:00:59 AM »
is there any way to measure in eagle?
and added on-board regulator :)
« Last Edit: April 22, 2009, 05:10:37 AM by SmAsH »
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Offline dellagd

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #79 on: April 22, 2009, 06:09:24 AM »
hah, yea when i started i was scared s*#tless of the $50 robot and attempted the $40 robot instead.
i think most people who have never been introduced to robotics would see a plastic box with wires coming out of it more easy than the same thing with no box, ie just a pcb with components soldered on.
@dellagd, no we aren't really doing that sort of thing where they link together like that. we are doing something where its just a bunch of pcbs that can be linked via i2c.
@all, ive put together an updated list of modules based on dunks list as he is a busy man and probably has netter things to be doing. if i have missed anything or you want something added please pm me about it.
 modules
 
EDIT: i have added in I2C to my motor driver... this is the order i have my pins in (SDA-SCL-GND-+5V) is this correct?
EDIT2: attached images to help :P


oh
cool
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Offline dunk

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #80 on: April 22, 2009, 06:16:20 AM »
is there any way to measure in eagle?
look at the numbers at the top left that change as you move the mouse.
they are the cursor's position.
you can set the units to either inches or mm somewhere in Eagle's settings.

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Offline dellagd

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #81 on: April 22, 2009, 06:18:14 AM »
dunk
are you in for the community project like me smash and Asellith?
(plz post under this if you are in)
« Last Edit: April 22, 2009, 06:19:25 AM by dellagd »
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Offline SmAsHTopic starter

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #82 on: April 22, 2009, 06:24:49 AM »
he was one of the main organizers of the project but i don't think he'll be doing it this year as he's busy.
and dellagd, are you making an acceleration module? if so i need to add you to the module list :)
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Offline Trumpkin

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #83 on: April 22, 2009, 08:09:04 AM »
Dohhhh already have to many projects going on to help you guys out with this one.  >:(
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Offline dellagd

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #84 on: April 22, 2009, 01:57:55 PM »
not currently
once I know how to make one for sure I will make a exceleromerter module
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Offline SmAsHTopic starter

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #85 on: April 22, 2009, 02:14:34 PM »
well i guess me and weird fishes are flying solo for a while (we picked the easy ones :P ) if you need any help in the future you know where to go ;)
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Offline Asellith

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #86 on: April 22, 2009, 05:04:40 PM »
To stop this from turning into another 8 page thread that scares people away from reading it, Why don't we go start splitting things up. If you have new things to talk about concerning the project entitle a new thread labeled SOR Community Project: (Whatever). That way we can keep things seperate. For instance if you start a module and want to ask question concerning just that or discuss a change to the board dimensions. Whatever the case it would be best to seperate them into new posts. People start seeing one thread about a project and they ignore it. If they see new ones popping up all the time it will let people know that the project is alive and then they will investigate it more. Also keeps us organized. This was discussed in the last post but never took off.

Oh and you guys working on module keep posting updates to keep interest alive. Not mundane stuff but every few days post something to let us know your alive and working on it. That will help attract attention.
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Offline SmAsHTopic starter

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #87 on: April 22, 2009, 05:37:59 PM »
ok asellith, if i find a new question i shall start another thread.
@dellagd (below this). i really doubt it is of that importance to start a new section. maaaybe if this gets off the ground but until then its a definite no.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2009, 06:10:46 PM by SmAsH »
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Offline dellagd

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #88 on: April 22, 2009, 06:03:42 PM »
good idea
maybe admin will make a new section of the forum this time
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Offline dellagd

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Re: SOR community project?
« Reply #89 on: April 24, 2009, 04:21:32 PM »
since we plan to make money off of this project do you think it should be COMPLETELY open source?
i mean, a company CEO could be browsing the internet and see this, snatch up the idea, a boom, now lego makes the money instead of us.
we need to like protect these ideas somehow
and my idea is to do this
make a weebly free webpage
like sorproject.weebly.com
and then make a subpage like sorproject.weebly.com/543925894.html
543925894 being the password
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