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Author Topic: Not start from scratch (for those who prefer...)  (Read 1168 times)

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Offline FrenchyDudeTopic starter

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Not start from scratch (for those who prefer...)
« on: January 03, 2010, 03:25:21 PM »
I realize I may be facing a rain off nasty comments over this post, but this is actually very serious:

WHY START FROM SCRATCH when you have products like the Rovio providing a great design, control method, nav functions, misc interfaces, software with public API (from what I read) and so on?

What additional hardware would it take to use the good stuff off the Rovio, and interface it to a bigger frame using the same system of wheels?
All in a "SYSTEM INTEGRATION APPROCHE" (as much as possible):

-3 modules to replace the Rovio's stepper motors and allow the control of bigger stepper motors.
-1 bigger and stronger battery charging unit (same voltage).
-1 bigger battery.
-3 wheels built using the same technology.
Are such modules already available to buy or build?

Once this is done, the bigger frame and available power will leave room for:
-Maybe one better camera could later be looked into? Or the option for a B&W "night-cam" with IR diodes (need to look into a possible interference with the TrueTrack IR system!)
-Headlights and so on.
-To control more options (on/off), the pins for the headlights option could be use to control different on/off latch relays based on some kind of time/mors-code sequences... and a little software writing.

Questions, ideas, some electronic and mechanical background, but very little programming knowledge.
And you know what they say, it's easier on paper.

So go on! What do you say?!


 :P

Offline SmAsH

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Re: Not start from scratch (for those who prefer...)
« Reply #1 on: January 03, 2010, 04:28:50 PM »
Quote
WHY START FROM SCRATCH when you have products like the Rovio providing a great design, control method, nav functions, misc interfaces, software with public API (from what I read) and so on?
Well, some of us get pleasure from building the robots, we like to be able to say "i built that" instead of "i bought that from walmart" see my point? Also, its nearly always cheaper to build it yourself as a fair few of us are lacking funds :P Also, you get to design it, customize it and not every 12 year old will have the same robot as you, hell...
Why not chuck a death ray on it, i bet walmart can't do that!

Quote
What additional hardware would it take to use the good stuff off the Rovio, and interface it to a bigger frame using the same system of wheels?
All in a "SYSTEM INTEGRATION APPROCHE" (as much as possible):
Well, if i was going to do it, i would get my own mcu to run the things such as the axon/2, my own platform which i think you have... I take it you just want to take the rovio and put it on a bigger frame with bigger motors, battery and wheels? You don't want  to get the individual components out of it and use your own microcontroller with it?

Quote
Are such modules already available to buy or build?
Yes and no. Similar things are availavle, search and see if what you need is there.
The onmi wheels are, search for them.
Stepper motor drivers are.
Batteries are, try to make it the same type as the rovoi's so the charging circuits work.

Quote
Once this is done, the bigger frame and available power will leave room for:
-Maybe one better camera could later be looked into? Or the option for a B&W "night-cam" with IR diodes (need to look into a possible interference with the TrueTrack IR system!)
-Headlights and so on.
-To control more options (on/off), the pins for the headlights option could be use to control different on/off latch relays based on some kind of time/mors-code sequences... and a little software writing.
The camera might be hard because the robot is build for that kind of camera so other modifications might be needed. Another good reason to build robots from scratch!
Headlights would be easy as pie!
« Last Edit: January 03, 2010, 04:31:56 PM by SmAsH »
Howdy

Offline Soeren

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Re: Not start from scratch (for those who prefer...)
« Reply #2 on: January 03, 2010, 06:25:30 PM »
Hi,

Why not chuck a death ray on it, i bet walmart can't do that!
I expect to see such a project from you in the course of the next month then!  :)

Apart from that, I fully agree, the fun is in building from scratch.
With kits and ready made equipment, you have to patch on other peoples design errors - much better to create your own. It may also be next to impossible to get schematics of prebuilt stuff.

But, different folks, different strokes, so for those who wanna go that route, be my guest.
Regards,
Søren

A rather fast and fairly heavy robot with quite large wheels needs what? A lot of power?
Please remember...
Engineering is based on numbers - not adjectives

Offline FrenchyDudeTopic starter

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Re: Not start from scratch (for those who prefer...)
« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2010, 12:51:04 AM »
Hi guys, thanks for your input,

Quote
Well, some of us get pleasure from building the robots, we like to be able to say "i built that" instead of "i bought that from walmart" see my point?
I totally agree with you guys, which is why I said "for those who prefer"  ;) but unless you prove me wrong (which would be great), I have not found a single completed robot project (I know, a good project is never perfect enough to be completed) with combined NorthStar navigation (or else of same type), duplex audio, video streaming, slick control interface and web control, all in one.

Quote
I take it you just want to take the Rovio and put it on a bigger frame with bigger motors, battery and wheels?
That's it. What I am talking about is an enhancement project in which (yes you need some funds) the starting point of your kit is a second hand Rovio from e-bay.
I would love to start from scratch, have my own MCU, software and all, with all the fun and possibilities this offers... but unfortunately, this is beyond my capabilities  :'(

Quote
The camera might be hard
Agreed. Maybe something to look into, later.

Quote
It may also be next to impossible to get schematics of prebuilt stuff
Yes, that's the problem, got to get the oscilloscope out on this one.

I'm going to search for the wheels, check the sizes out-there. And look for a driver board to drive a bigger stepper-motor using stepper motor signals (and not rs-232 or other digital from MCUs), but that is going to be next to no-use since I don't know the spec of the signal going to the Rovio's motors, yet.



Offline little-c

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Re: Not start from scratch (for those who prefer...)
« Reply #4 on: January 04, 2010, 11:54:02 AM »
death ray?

take a microwave, nick the microwave bit out of it, object following algorithim, nuke the guys in the red shirts....

short expusure, death from cancer.

easy as pie. though they might be able to cause some pain before death from cancer kicks in. so better up the power and go for radiation burns and sickness instead!

anyway,

personal view, depends on what you are doing. if your proving you new fancy mapping algorithim, you don't need an all singing all dancing robot, so a hacked prebuilt/kit robot would be more apropriate for a cheep project.

Offline madchimp

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Re: Not start from scratch (for those who prefer...)
« Reply #5 on: January 04, 2010, 12:57:00 PM »

Quote
I take it you just want to take the Rovio and put it on a bigger frame with bigger motors, battery and wheels?
That's it. What I am talking about is an enhancement project in which (yes you need some funds) the starting point of your kit is a second hand Rovio from e-bay.
I would love to start from scratch, have my own MCU, software and all, with all the fun and possibilities this offers... but unfortunately, this is beyond my capabilities  :'(


You don't have to build from scratch there are all kinds of prebuilt modules out there for just about every part of a robot. I would personally think it would be easier to start from "scratch" then to reverse engineer and then design around the limitations of a store bought.

Offline Asellith

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Re: Not start from scratch (for those who prefer...)
« Reply #6 on: January 04, 2010, 02:12:40 PM »
The Rovio is a cool robot. however if you wanted to build something that didn't do what the rovio does then there is no reason to buy a rovio and try to make it do things the army of engineers at WowWee didn't design it to do.

Realistically frame and locomotion are the easier parts of most robots. For instance it took me very little time to design a similar 3 wheel omnidirectional robot. Mine moves and does simple navigation. Took 2 days of programming and maybe 2 weeks of very limited time to build the frame. 2 months later I am still working on the final programing for the second stage with the oscar module. I could make the robot do everything the final version would do in maybe a night of programming but designing and building the module is the hard part.

does my robot do everything that Rovio can do? No. do i have the freedom to rebuild and change it as needed? Yes. Will I get as complex as the Rovio. Eventually but right now I'm working on my module design.

Prebuilt verses custom has been a problem for most people. Play to your strengths. If your a coder buy a complete robot package. If your not so much of a programmer but you like building things spend more time on a good frame and then use an easy to program controller. That is why I want to try and get the oscar module system we have been working on off the ground. Then with simple programming a robot can do complex things such as video and audio streaming with simple modules. Right now I'm working on a distance/object avoidance module. I'm going to build from there and as more and more people get into the project we will soon have a few dozen modules designed and programmed. Then you can almost plug and play the features you want into the frame you have or you build.
Jonathan Bowen
CorSec Engineering
www.corseceng.com

Offline z.s.tar.gz

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Re: Not start from scratch (for those who prefer...)
« Reply #7 on: January 04, 2010, 07:47:05 PM »
The way I see it, it's just like making your own pizza. It's way cheaper, you can have some fun, and it's just nice to know your pizza is exactly how you like it.
But that doesn't fit every case, and sometimes all you want is a pizza, even if you have to buy it from Papa John's.
Save yourself the typing. Just call me Zach.

 


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